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Attack of the Clone Problems
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Star Wars: Episode VIII: Binds of Tyranny Forum Index » Questions and Suggestions » Attack of the Clone Problems
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Volytar
First Sergeant


Joined: 24 Jul 2006
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 04:55pm    Post subject:
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Please...tell that to the trainers of the Stormtrooper corps who have been pumping out the greatest millitary elite since the Cuy'val Dar were removed as primary trainers for the Imperial Elite - given that Cuy'val Dar =/= Mando's my statement still stands they were 75% Mando...but not all of them could be considered loyal to the Empire anymore....Walon Vau certainly retired to a civilian life and the non-humans, such as the known sullustan member would have been evicted from their posts....
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Kalydon Skirata
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 04:58pm    Post subject:
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Volytar wrote:
Please...tell that to the trainers of the Stormtrooper corps who have been pumping out the greatest millitary elite since the Cuy'val Dar were removed as primary trainers for the Imperial Elite - given that Cuy'val Dar =/= Mando's my statement still stands they were 75% Mando...but not all of them could be considered loyal to the Empire anymore....Walon Vau certainly retired to a civilian life and the non-humans, such as the known sullustan member would have been evicted from their posts....


I stopped reading and caring when I saw "greatest military elite".

Considering they miserably failed to stop the Rebels I think they've earned their own disgrace along with Palpatine and Tarkin.
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Last edited by Kalydon Skirata on Fri, May 18th 2007 04:59pm; edited 1 time in total
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Ams Jendob
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 05:05pm    Post subject:
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Hey, hey. Easy, you two...
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Volytar
First Sergeant


Joined: 24 Jul 2006
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 05:14pm    Post subject:
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Oh please...thats an unfair analgy of their abilities...the Rebels won...BECAUSE THEY WERE THE GOOD GUYS...I point out that the Imperial Stormtrooper Corps, or what formed it, successfully defeated jedi in their droves were the Mando's got their asses handed to them every time they encountered Jedi as the enemy...

The point beeing that the reason Mando's and Stormtroopers never live up to their reputation is because they are allways in the badguy slot - but a pretty evident factor of their abilities is when they are in the good-guy slot and totally wipe out all opposition. Mando's in the good guy slot? They are getting absolutley slaughtered on Mandalore untill the Alliance shows up to give them aid...so heh...guess you underestimated the STC a tensie bit?
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Kalydon Skirata
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 05:18pm    Post subject:
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Ams Jendob wrote:
Hey, hey. Easy, you two...


You're right, I have better things to do than to argue over fictional characters, I'll be the bigger man and bow out of this before it gets out of hand.
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Field Marshall Kalydon Skirata
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Alatáriël Pallanén
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 05:38pm    Post subject:
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Kalydon Skirata wrote:
Volytar wrote:
Please...tell that to the trainers of the Stormtrooper corps who have been pumping out the greatest millitary elite since the Cuy'val Dar were removed as primary trainers for the Imperial Elite - given that Cuy'val Dar =/= Mando's my statement still stands they were 75% Mando...but not all of them could be considered loyal to the Empire anymore....Walon Vau certainly retired to a civilian life and the non-humans, such as the known sullustan member would have been evicted from their posts....


I stopped reading and caring when I saw "greatest military elite".

Considering they miserably failed to stop the Rebels I think they've earned their own disgrace along with Palpatine and Tarkin.


The Galactic Empire was created by Palpatine... so how could he be a disgrace?
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Alatáriël Pallanén-Davad
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Kalydon Skirata
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 06:23pm    Post subject:
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Alatáriël Pallanén wrote:

The Galactic Empire was created by Palpatine... so how could he be a disgrace?


Death Stars, and how much of a waste they were in terms of:
-Manpower
-Resources
-Time

For the cost of the Death Stars, the Empire could have constructed dozens more fleets and Executors to go with them.
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Alatáriël Pallanén
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 06:24pm    Post subject:
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In your opinion that might be a better idea.

I would have to say the Death Star was a far more interesting vessel. than having dozens of vessels running around the galaxy.
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Brote Heckler
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 06:25pm    Post subject:
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Um... the Empire was a government that expanded over millions of systems, canonly, and their fleet was huge. But the Rebellion was a ideal based organization, it controlled minds not power and it used guerrillas tactics, the Death Star would have been the only solution.
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Kalydon Skirata
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 06:29pm    Post subject:
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Alatáriël Pallanén wrote:
In your opinion that might be a better idea.

I would have to say the Death Star was a far more interesting vessel. than having dozens of vessels running around the galaxy.


With a Death Star you can cover one system at a time, with dozens if not hundreds of extra fleets you can cover dozens if not hundreds of systems.

It's all about maximizing the potential of what you have to work with, in Wrinkles' case, he squandered it on a useless endeavor proposed to him by a lunatic old man.
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Volytar
First Sergeant


Joined: 24 Jul 2006
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 06:29pm    Post subject:
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Brote's right the, Death Star was massivley viable as a weapon of pure fear - what undermined it was that both times it was deployed complete and utter foolish arrogance - on the part of Tarkin and on the part of Palpatine - as well as the fact that the people they were fighting were the good guys and had just happened to recieve a force sensative at the right moment of time or in the other case the stormtroopers had been suplied with a batch of armour made out of sugar-board that was vulnerable to stones...
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Alatáriël Pallanén
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 06:34pm    Post subject:
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Kalydon Skirata wrote:
Alatáriël Pallanén wrote:
In your opinion that might be a better idea.

I would have to say the Death Star was a far more interesting vessel. than having dozens of vessels running around the galaxy.


With a Death Star you can cover one system at a time, with dozens if not hundreds of extra fleets you can cover dozens if not hundreds of systems.

It's all about maximizing the potential of what you have to work with, in Wrinkles' case, he squandered it on a useless endeavor proposed to him by a lunatic old man.


The Death Star can cover the entire galaxy, through fear. If the Death Star had managed to destroy Yavin IV... do you honestly believe dozens of other fleets and officers to man those, maintaince and that such would really be required? No, because worlds would deny the rebellion any kind of presence in fear of the superlaser.
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Alatáriël Pallanén-Davad
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Kalydon Skirata
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 06:39pm    Post subject:
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Alatáriël Pallanén wrote:
Kalydon Skirata wrote:
Alatáriël Pallanén wrote:
In your opinion that might be a better idea.

I would have to say the Death Star was a far more interesting vessel. than having dozens of vessels running around the galaxy.


With a Death Star you can cover one system at a time, with dozens if not hundreds of extra fleets you can cover dozens if not hundreds of systems.

It's all about maximizing the potential of what you have to work with, in Wrinkles' case, he squandered it on a useless endeavor proposed to him by a lunatic old man.


The Death Star can cover the entire galaxy, through fear. If the Death Star had managed to destroy Yavin IV... do you honestly believe dozens of other fleets and officers to man those, maintaince and that such would really be required? No, because worlds would deny the rebellion any kind of presence in fear of the superlaser.


There's this fear concept again. Well that rule through fear thing failed miserably didn't it? On both occasions I might add.:p

Whereas the extra fleets could never be brought down by a single one-man fighter. If necessary those dozens to hundreds of fleets could also provide dozens if not hundreds of Base Delta Zeros simultaneously.
There's your rule through fear if you want to use that argument.
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Volytar
First Sergeant


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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 06:43pm    Post subject:
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Jah...but if the DS1 had not been defeated by a sudden twist of plot it would have successfully cut the head off the snake by eliminating most of the Rebel High Command - or at least resulting in their capture - the point was that the Empire possesed all of the fleets it needed but Rebels need something that can easily drag people into line rathen than keep order like a fleet can.
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Brote Heckler
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 06:44pm    Post subject:
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No one would have cared about BDZ, it was a little use tactic, a Death Star would have meant that anywhere in the galaxy a gigantic death station could pop up, blow up your fleet and then your world. For BDZ to have been an effective tool of fear it would have had to been reinforced, then you would have seen a lot of stuff dieing away and the galaxy would have BEEN MORE likely to rebel. The Death Star only needed to be built once to show to the galaxy rebellion was over.
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"All warfare is based on deception. Hence, when able to attack, we must seem unable; when using our forces, we must seem inactive; when we are near, we must make the enemy believe we are far away; when far away, we must make him believe we are near." - Sun Tzu
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Ams Jendob
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 06:49pm    Post subject:
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The other issue is a Base Delta Zero operation takes about several hours for an ISD to execute. A lot of people could get away.

A Death Star offers no escape, not even a prayer of survival. Everyone on the planet, even in their air, is dead. A Base Delta Zero didn't create a wound in Force; Alderaan did.
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Volytar
First Sergeant


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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 06:56pm    Post subject:
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Thats what you get from snuffing out all those lives all at once...the Death Star is a weapon that creates loyalty through fear of joining others - the BDZ is a tactic of supression designed to deaden dissident voices - hence the use against Camaas.
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Kalydon Skirata
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 07:08pm    Post subject:
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Bah, the way I'm thinking would work if the Empire in the movies wasn't so oppressive and people actually weren't fearful of it or serving it.:p

For Palpatine's Empire I can see it's use now...but I still would have gone a different route, something along the lines of the Eclipse, just bigger...but not as big as a small moon.
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Brote Heckler
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 07:12pm    Post subject:
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Wow... what were you smoking when you joined the Empire? :P
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"All warfare is based on deception. Hence, when able to attack, we must seem unable; when using our forces, we must seem inactive; when we are near, we must make the enemy believe we are far away; when far away, we must make him believe we are near." - Sun Tzu
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Volytar
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 07:16pm    Post subject:
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The same thing Pellaeon was smoking when he signed the treaty that brought the remenant to peace with the New Republic? As for the Eclipse...I don't care what Wizards have decided...it was not a planet destroying turbolaser...it was like the ones mounted on the Errant Venture...deadly to ships but not to planets.
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Brote Heckler
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 07:20pm    Post subject:
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Does atmosphere deteriorate weapon capability?
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Kalydon Skirata
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 07:21pm    Post subject:
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Volytar wrote:
The same thing Pellaeon was smoking when he signed the treaty that brought the remenant to peace with the New Republic? As for the Eclipse...I don't care what Wizards have decided...it was not a planet destroying turbolaser...it was like the ones mounted on the Errant Venture...deadly to ships but not to planets.


Hence why I said "bigger".

The standard Eclipse cannon was rated at cracking large pieces of planetary crust...but not the whole planet. Increase the size of the ship, include more power generators and perhaps more can be done with it.
Then again, one could just build more than one Eclipse at a time and combine the firepower.
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Volytar
First Sergeant


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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 07:26pm    Post subject:
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Brote Heckler wrote:
Does atmosphere deteriorate weapon capability?


Depends on the atmosphere...high radiation renders blasters and other energy weapons useless.
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Nevin Antilles
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 Post Posted: Fri, May 18th 2007 10:43pm    Post subject:
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High winds would effect the larger projectile weapons, such as ground-to-air missles that AA turrets might launch.
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Volytar
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 Post Posted: Sat, May 19th 2007 04:54am    Post subject:
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Oh and electro-magnetic storms play havok on tracking systems for missiles to...
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